- The Source of Our Resentments

The Source of Our Resentments




12 Steps: Discussions related to the 12 Steps and using them as a treatment to recover from alcohol and drug addiction.

Postby Jools » Wed Jul 08, 2009 8:52 pm

I believe it, I still am thinking with an alcoholic mind. I'm still working the steps, currently step 7 and we're taking a lot longer than I wanted. I feel like I was more "willing" when I was hurting so bad, now that things are a little better it's not such a hurry and when the sponsor puts me off, it's ok..it's ok I tell her.

It's not ok anymore. We're meeting tomorrow evening b4 the meeting. I'm at a place where I can see all of this self stuff and this topic really brought it to the forefront for me.

Thanx Dallas.
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Postby tim-one » Thu Jul 09, 2009 7:00 am

Primer to my reply:

Is it ok to refer to the 12x12 as "another book"?

That is NOT an antagonistic question. I just want to rightly comply.

Please let me know before I reply. And soon ... my fingers is itchy. :wink:

Love,
Tim1

PS: Question does NOT come from resentment, but from willing obedience.
I firmly agree with the rule, though I had previously disobeyed.

I erroneously understood that specifying that a quote from another book was apropos as long as it agreed with or supported the BB on a subject. subject.

I regret my assumption and presumption. I repent. Please forgive me.

Mea culpa. Mea culpa. Mea maxima culpa. :cry:
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Postby GeoffS » Thu Jul 09, 2009 7:41 am

shouldn't imagine anyone around here would have a problem with you referring to the 12 by 12, or any other AA conference approved literature.
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Postby Dallas » Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:07 am

YES! THERE IS AN OBJECTION!

Please read the very first post of this topic, especially the letters that are bolded Then, scroll down to about post #8, if message #1 is not clear.

BIG BOOK ONLY!. No 12&12, no Bible, no "OTHER" AA conference approved literature, or any other kind of literature... Just the BB. If you do not have one, one will be provided free of charge for the purpose of this discussion.

Now... Will there be exceptions to this? Probably... later on.
Especially if it is something historical in nature... that pertains to the subject and the topic. Example: There may be something in 'AA Comes of Age' or 'Pass it On!" ... that is relevant.

The idea is not to be "ultra rigid" we simply want some structure and discipline to keep it on track with the topic.

If you have something that might be a good exception... please send a PM and ask! :wink: (You might have a great and valid point! I don't want to miss it if it applies! )

The Topic is: Self-Centeredness as the source of resentments.

We are doing one idea at a time here to stay focused and on track with the discussion. (Seems like I recently already wrote that!)

If you want to add willingness, obedience, honesty, open-mindedness or other topics, or if you want to include 12 & 12 & other AA literature... Please start a new Topic that is not connected to this topic.... There you can do whatever you desire to do. :wink:

For those with future questions... Before you ask the question... Please start at the top of this thread and read each post -- I'm sure it will most likely answer your questions. THEN, if you still have a question -- please ask it. And, thank you for asking first -- it is VERY MUCH appreciated! :wink:

One exception: If you are using a dictionary that was published in the years 1935 to 1938, that will be alright as long as it's directly related to the topic at hand.

One more tiny exception: I hate to do this it will probably open up a can of worms... Before Bill Wilson wrote the BB, he was influenced by reading "William James, Varieties of Religious Experience" That's the book that his sponsor Ebby brought to him at Townes Hospital, were he got sober... that's where Bill states that he got many of his ideas ... So, Varieties of Religious Experience by William James, could prove to be a logical exception to our guideline because it will define Bill Wilson's understanding of concepts like "Self" and "Ego" that Bill was referring to when he wrote about those ideas in our book.

One of the main points here is that we want to be in that era of 1934-1939 and understand the minds of those that were the Pioneers of A.A.

Now, I'll rush up to the top thread and add those two tiny exceptions! Glad you brought it up! Thanks again.

BTW: Any changes to the guidelines for this discussion will be added to the first message posted in this topic -- for clarifiaction. So, watch for the "last edited" times and dates of that first message.

YES there will probably be consideration for additional exceptions as we get further along in the discussion -- if it is relevant to the topic.

(See. I wrote that at least twice so that it will be easy to find).



Dallas
Last edited by Dallas on Thu Jul 09, 2009 4:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby tim-one » Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:37 am

Whew, I hope I un-posted in time. You posted that while I was writing.

Thanks, Dallas. And Geoff :? :)

I think I'll just stay out of this one. :P

Love,
Tim
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Postby Dallas » Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:58 am

Ok. I understand. Big Book centered discussions are not for everyone. Probably just us die-hard Big Book A.A. fans!

I'll watch the board to see if you start a different topic. Maybe I can participate in that one, too! I can multi-task! I'm alcoholic! :wink:

Quick note added here: I started to write an exception here to let a die-hard Energizer Big Book Bunny know that I didn't mean anything personal by that statement... It's just a generalization... "some people" do not like BB centered discussions... and "some people" just like to listen or read... doesn't mean they are not interested... or not a Big Big Book Fan.
Last edited by Dallas on Thu Jul 09, 2009 3:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby angel143 » Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:19 am

Dallas wrote:I had been doing what so many other new people do -- I had been trying to "learn and understand" -- while still possessing the "alcoholic mind."

Until the "alcoholic mind" has been done away with -- all of the learning and understanding that we gain "with the alcoholic mind" will be useless information that we have to discard "absolutely"... when it comes time to "getting sober again"... if we don't change before the alcoholic mind takes us back to drinking.

I now see this over and over and over and over again -- with people that either freshly come in to A.A., or return to A.A. time and again -- they get into "thinking" and they are "thinking with the alcoholic mind" because it hasn't yet been transformed, the way it needs to be transformed, when they get to Step 10.

The "alcoholic mind" will still be talking to them from Steps 1 through 8, and half of Step 9. It will be telling them false things and they won't be able to see it. (Dr.'s Opinion "differentiate between truth and false" until the "psychic change" takes place at Step 10.

It's also one of the problems that A.A.'s face when they take too long to go through the Steps. They are still operating with "the alcoholic mind" -- and they "can't see it" because they still have it!

Dallas


Thank you!!!!
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Postby Dallas » Thu Jul 09, 2009 11:19 am

[b]I think the best place to start in the discussion of this topic of “Self-Centerednessâ€
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Postby GeoffS » Thu Jul 09, 2009 6:49 pm

I don't know if Silkworth gets the credit for his treatment of Bill's hot flash.

Bill was under the Belladonna Rx. Belladonna is a muscle relaxant amongst other things. Its active ingredient is atropine (like mandrake btw) side effects include photophobia (extreme sensitivity to light ), extreme confusion and dissociative hallucinations (experiencing sensations without reason).

When Bill told Silkworth of his 'hot flash' and what he thought about it, Silkworth had two choices.

i the medical explanation
ii the variety of religious experience explanation

thank god he went for number 2.
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Postby DiggerinVA » Thu Jul 09, 2009 7:19 pm

I agree being self-centered is a key element of resentments. All driven by fear and self-will. I'm glad I can see it today, it was miserable. SOme things I observe which at one time would become a resentment are now nothing more than an observation; with an apathetic (best word I can come up with) feeling attached.

Here is a JPG of the Forward of the 14th printing of the Big Book.

Image

Though I must say that the Copy of the Manuscript says:

We, of Alcoholics Anonymous, are more than one hundred men and women who have recovered from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body. To show other alcoholics PRECISELY HOW THEY CAN RECOVER is the main purpose of this book. For them, we think these pages will prove so convincing that no further authentication will be necessary. We hope this account of our experiences will help everyone to better understand the alcoholic. Many do not yet comprehend that he is a very sick person. And besides, we are sure that our new way of living has its advantages for all.

Interesting stuff: I have never seen the 1st printing though I am probably going to order the reprint. Yes I like the Big Book I finally have a working owners manual for myself. When I do what it says life works.
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